Help please! Our 1 year old Pyr mix (supposedly she's 1/2 Pyr, 1/2 Anatolian) has been getting increasingly aggressive with our goats. We put her in with the goats at 10 weeks old, and for a long time she did great with them. She started to chase them as she got older, which would stress the goats out, so we always told her "NO" and she would stop. Lately however, we've been noticing bite marks on our goats legs, and several weeks ago we found one of our goats dead. We can't say for sure what killed her, but there were fresh bite marks on her legs. Not deep enough wounds to kill, but maybe the stress of it just did her in. When we've caught her chasing or nipping at the goats back legs when she was younger we assumed she was just playing, but my husband would immediately put her on the ground in a hold, which has worked for other issues in the past like nipping us too hard while playing. However her aggression is getting markedly worse, and my husband has caught her in the act twice this week of gnawing on one of their legs like a chicken bone while the goat is screaming bloody murder. This last attack she would not stop even with my husband running out there and yelling NO at her. Who knows how many more attacks we've missed. Our goat is now hyperventilating and not putting weight on her leg. Our other goat won't come into the barn at night because the dog is in there, preferring instead to now sleep outside in the elements and with prowling predators instead. The dog knows basic commands (sit, stay, come) and has always recognized us as alphas, but we don't know what to do from here and cannot let our goats continue to suffer like this. This has been extremely stressful for my husband, we're open to any suggestions you have. Thank you
Pyr attacking goats
- Thread starter crisjoy
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secuono
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No more free access to the livestock.
I'd use an ecollar, but only if you know how to use it. With aggression added in, it's super important to zap her at the right time or it could make it far worse.
Though, it sounds more like a bored pup testing limits than a pup developing aggression. You're not mentioning growling, snapping, guarding or anything typically aggressive related.
Find other things to occupy her mind with, she's bored shytless. If you don't have an older dog for her to play with, you might have to take that roll. Or dog feed puzzles/toys might help.
Long leash when with the livestock, supervised only. When she locks onto a sheep with her eyes or body, yank the leash hard and continue your life like nothing happened. Need to catch it when it first starts, not when she's already chasing or biting.
1yr is another teen spurt of challenging others and testing boundaries. Doesn't matter if she respected commands before, as now she may stop until she actually believes a human can tell her what to do again.
I'm no pro though. I stay away from anything Anatolian now after the nightmare of my past dog. GP or Maremma only for me.
I forget who the dog experts are, but they'll find the thread soon.
I'd use an ecollar, but only if you know how to use it. With aggression added in, it's super important to zap her at the right time or it could make it far worse.
Though, it sounds more like a bored pup testing limits than a pup developing aggression. You're not mentioning growling, snapping, guarding or anything typically aggressive related.
Find other things to occupy her mind with, she's bored shytless. If you don't have an older dog for her to play with, you might have to take that roll. Or dog feed puzzles/toys might help.
Long leash when with the livestock, supervised only. When she locks onto a sheep with her eyes or body, yank the leash hard and continue your life like nothing happened. Need to catch it when it first starts, not when she's already chasing or biting.
1yr is another teen spurt of challenging others and testing boundaries. Doesn't matter if she respected commands before, as now she may stop until she actually believes a human can tell her what to do again.
I'm no pro though. I stay away from anything Anatolian now after the nightmare of my past dog. GP or Maremma only for me.
I forget who the dog experts are, but they'll find the thread soon.
rachels.haven
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thank you for weighing in, I really appreciate it. You're right in that I don't notice other signs of aggression like growling or snapping, and she's still great with us humans. She might be bored, I figured having a job like guarding her flock and territory would keep her occupied but maybe not. Also I hadn't heard that Anatolians can be problematic 🤔
Ridgetop
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We have had both Pyrenees and Anatolians over 35 years of small stock keeping. Both breeds (and most others) all have their own problems. The success of the breed for you depends on your protection needs, the individual dog, and your training ability. It also helps to buy from a breeder who is familiar with his dogs' abilities and knows how to choose a puppy/dog for your needs. Adopting an LGD from a shelter/rescue is risky, since there is a reason they are there. Before addressing your chase problem, let's talk about LGDs.
Are you sure that she is an LGD cross without any other breed tossed in there? Crosses are often unpredictable. You don't know which parent's DNA will come out in the puppy. Not all LGDs in a litter become great livestock guardians. Just because a dog is an LGD breed does not mean it will make a good livestock guardian. Many of them never become good livestock guardians. Some excel from puppyhood, other are good farm guardians, still others make good family pets. Some LGDs never show this "puppy play" chase and bite behavior, others do. Some will never be trustworthy LGDs and will continue the behavior. Others can be trained.
First, you must understand that an LGD bonds to the flock and family as they would to a pack member. Once you understand how LGDs think (not easy since they are not like other dogs) you can try to anticipate their behavior. The human family and flock become their pack. Young dogs do not see a difference between humans, the flock, and other pack members. Some LGDs go through a period of "puppy play" with their sheep or goats. If you watch a litter of puppies play, or 2 dog playing, you will notice that they are biting each other and "play fighting". LGDs see the sheep/goats as puppies/dogs and play with them in the same way they would play with other dogs. This is where the biting at legs and ears comes in.
Any jumping on you and nipping has been dealt with in puppyhood. Fellow dogs in the pack will use their teeth to deflect nipping during play. The sheep or goats however, do not react that way. They will run away resulting in the dg chasing them and biting at their legs. Sheep will not turn on the dog and bite it back and since they are running the dog believes that they are enjoying the play.
There can be 2 separate stages of "puppy play". That first stage you have already passed through at 4-6 months of age. Now the dog is going through its "teenage puppy play" period. This is more dangerous since injuries inflicted by adult dog teeth are much more serious. The best way to stop this play is with "self-correction". Put the dog in a pen with very aggressive rams or bucks. As the dog tries to play with them, they will knock the dog down. This is "self-correcting" training. If you don't have any bucks or rams (or does/ewes) that are able to do this, you need to remove the dog from running freely with the flock. The dog can only be allowed access to the flock under supervision. Put the dog on a 20' training lead and choke chain and go in the pasture with the flock. As soon as the dog shows interest in chasing the flock use a short hard yank, immediately release tension on the lead, and praise the dog for stopping the chase behavior. Don't shout at the dog, use a quiet voice. Often shouting at the dog is not the right way to discipline. Often the dog thinks the shouts are meant to urge him on in his behavior. If you are a pasture away, you can't control the dog other than by your voice but if he thinks you are urging him to continue the play shouting won't work. With training you can stop the chase behavior while you are with the dog. Once the dog is showing no interest in chase behavior remove the lead. Use your voice and commands to control the dog's chase behavior.
Unfortunately, the dog will soon recognize the difference between being on the lead and being free without physical control. This is the same problem with using a shock collar. The dog will recognize when the collar is on and when it is off. (When I was training dogs and showing, my dog knew the difference between the training collar, show lead, and regular collar. Their reactions to each were happy but different.)
If you don't have any fairly dominant bucks (or does), put the sheep in a smaller pen and allow the dog to range around them if the predator problem is bad. If the sheep are afraid to go in the barn at night, remove the dog before driving them in. Then close the gate/door and leave the dog outside the barn. The dog does not have to be in the barn with the sheep to protect them.
With training you can eventually work through this problem.
Are you sure that she is an LGD cross without any other breed tossed in there? Crosses are often unpredictable. You don't know which parent's DNA will come out in the puppy. Not all LGDs in a litter become great livestock guardians. Just because a dog is an LGD breed does not mean it will make a good livestock guardian. Many of them never become good livestock guardians. Some excel from puppyhood, other are good farm guardians, still others make good family pets. Some LGDs never show this "puppy play" chase and bite behavior, others do. Some will never be trustworthy LGDs and will continue the behavior. Others can be trained.
First, you must understand that an LGD bonds to the flock and family as they would to a pack member. Once you understand how LGDs think (not easy since they are not like other dogs) you can try to anticipate their behavior. The human family and flock become their pack. Young dogs do not see a difference between humans, the flock, and other pack members. Some LGDs go through a period of "puppy play" with their sheep or goats. If you watch a litter of puppies play, or 2 dog playing, you will notice that they are biting each other and "play fighting". LGDs see the sheep/goats as puppies/dogs and play with them in the same way they would play with other dogs. This is where the biting at legs and ears comes in.
Any jumping on you and nipping has been dealt with in puppyhood. Fellow dogs in the pack will use their teeth to deflect nipping during play. The sheep or goats however, do not react that way. They will run away resulting in the dg chasing them and biting at their legs. Sheep will not turn on the dog and bite it back and since they are running the dog believes that they are enjoying the play.
There can be 2 separate stages of "puppy play". That first stage you have already passed through at 4-6 months of age. Now the dog is going through its "teenage puppy play" period. This is more dangerous since injuries inflicted by adult dog teeth are much more serious. The best way to stop this play is with "self-correction". Put the dog in a pen with very aggressive rams or bucks. As the dog tries to play with them, they will knock the dog down. This is "self-correcting" training. If you don't have any bucks or rams (or does/ewes) that are able to do this, you need to remove the dog from running freely with the flock. The dog can only be allowed access to the flock under supervision. Put the dog on a 20' training lead and choke chain and go in the pasture with the flock. As soon as the dog shows interest in chasing the flock use a short hard yank, immediately release tension on the lead, and praise the dog for stopping the chase behavior. Don't shout at the dog, use a quiet voice. Often shouting at the dog is not the right way to discipline. Often the dog thinks the shouts are meant to urge him on in his behavior. If you are a pasture away, you can't control the dog other than by your voice but if he thinks you are urging him to continue the play shouting won't work. With training you can stop the chase behavior while you are with the dog. Once the dog is showing no interest in chase behavior remove the lead. Use your voice and commands to control the dog's chase behavior.
Unfortunately, the dog will soon recognize the difference between being on the lead and being free without physical control. This is the same problem with using a shock collar. The dog will recognize when the collar is on and when it is off. (When I was training dogs and showing, my dog knew the difference between the training collar, show lead, and regular collar. Their reactions to each were happy but different.)
If you don't have any fairly dominant bucks (or does), put the sheep in a smaller pen and allow the dog to range around them if the predator problem is bad. If the sheep are afraid to go in the barn at night, remove the dog before driving them in. Then close the gate/door and leave the dog outside the barn. The dog does not have to be in the barn with the sheep to protect them.
With training you can eventually work through this problem.
secuono
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That one is just my experience and opinion that I won't have another again. Lots of people have them with less issues.
